[PINCAB] MrGrynch's Pincab Project

[Draco1962]

I don't trust gravity. 

[tthurman]

My final solution was in fact to use gravity.

I'm using a piece of cable runway bolted on a wooden mount I built that is pitched for the playfield.  I will be using a VESA multi-adapter that will screw into square wood that fits exactly into the cable runway openings.  Once mounted to the TV it will just drop in and can't go anywhere, we'll unless you flip it over.  

I got the idea based the idea off a French cleat.

There are all sorts of variants and ways to make these, even locking styles.

 

 

 

 

I must half a dozen or more mounts that I attempted to integrate along the way.

 

[MrGrynch]

@tthurmanthat's pretty slick!  Something tells me this isn't my last attempt either!  Machine is cleaned up.. VESA wall mount installed.. Display should be here in an hour or so!

 

[Draco1962]

3 hours ago, tthurman said:

My final solution was in fact to use gravity.

I'm using a piece of cable runway bolted on a wooden mount I built that is pitched for the playfield.  I will be using a VESA multi-adapter that will screw into square wood that fits exactly into the cable runway openings.  Once mounted to the TV it will just drop in and can't go anywhere, we'll unless you flip it over.  

I got the idea based the idea off a French cleat.

There are all sorts of variants and ways to make these, even locking styles.

 

 

 

 

I must half a dozen or more mounts that I attempted to integrate along the way.

 

Let me rephrase, I don't trust gravity on a flat or near flat surface that may need to be raised for access. 

A French cleat or variant is an excellent use of gravity when on a flat vertical surface. A friend of mine used a similar mounting technique for when a big screen was being mounted and the studs were off center. Since the mount was stationary, it worked perfect.

[MrGrynch]

Well this is weird.  I bought a universal mounting kit, which includes M8 screws, which Sony says are the right size for my TV, but, they don't fit.  I'm scratching my head here.  They are long enough, but seem too wide.  All of the smaller sizes are too small though

[MrGrynch]

Nevermind!  There are metal spacers that are supposed to come with the TV that supports the screw.  Apparently they are missing from mine

 

[MrGrynch]

Did a dry fit to test it out.  Dimensions are perfect.  Definitely have to deal with some gaps.  Now to wait for the spacer screws

 

[tthurman]

On 5/27/2022 at 3:00 PM, Draco1962 said:

Let me rephrase, I don't trust gravity on a flat or near flat surface that may need to be raised for access. 

A French cleat or variant is an excellent use of gravity when on a flat vertical surface. A friend of mine used a similar mounting technique for when a big screen was being mounted and the studs were off center. Since the mount was stationary, it worked perfect.

I would agree when used inside of a pincab but with my Frankenstein style build it won't be lifted except to remove and replace.  It simply spans the distance from pedestal to the display stand on a set of "Pinball X" flippers.

Apologies for the threadjack, but it's much easier to see it than to try and describe it.

[MrGrynch]

While I wait for the spacer screws for my Sony Bravia display, I've decided to scrap the wall-mount idea.  It's just too flimsy in my opinion.  Instead, I am going to add a board of wood with the VESA holes drilled through.  I will also add slots along the side to allow up/down adjustability with wing nuts to secure it.  I'm not really a wood-worker, but I found this nice little gadget to help me.  I have a Dremel tool which I use a lot, and this will add much more utility to it!

Dremel Plunge Router attachment

Future projects:

• Expand DMD opening to make a FullDMD
• Better button controller (iPac or Pinscape)
• Analog plunger
• Force feedback
• Surround sound
• LED effects

[Draco1962]

Let me know how the plunge router attachment works out for you.

Take good pics and share of your mount process! Looking forward to seeing your progress!

[Mike_da_Spike]

On 5/31/2022 at 7:28 PM, MrGrynch said:

Future projects:

• Expand DMD opening to make a FullDMD
• Better button controller (iPac or Pinscape)
• Analog plunger
• Force feedback
• Surround sound
• LED effects

I switched over to pinscape last year as my virtuapin controller stopped working. Bennefits of it, is that the board can be replaced by a cheap board and reprogram it.

I went for the kit with the analog plunger. It is a potentiometer that you can attach to every analog plunger (I alread had a plunger). The potentiometer makes the plunger much preciser than a analog to digital convertor.

What do you want with force feedack ? Use DOF ?  Pinscape has some ports for adding lights and/or feedback devices.

I already had a ledwiz with 32 ports. If hou don't use that much, the pinscape can be enough as well (but realize that flashers and rgb flasher take up a lot of ports)

Note : if you want to use device like knocker, solenoids, blowers etc, do not attach them directly to you vontroller, but use small relais. Als use diodes to not blow up you device or psu

Surround sound feedback is really a must have (my opinion). It is not too expensive, but gives a very good pinball experience ( if the table author didn't mess with the sounds)

What kind of full DMD do you want ? Lcd or real 128x32 leds ?

Good luck with your journey!

 

[MrGrynch]

10 hours ago, Mike_da_Spike said:

I switched over to pinscape last year as my virtuapin controller stopped working. Bennefits of it, is that the board can be replaced by a cheap board and reprogram it.

I went for the kit with the analog plunger. It is a potentiometer that you can attach to every analog plunger (I alread had a plunger). The potentiometer makes the plunger much preciser than a analog to digital convertor.

What do you want with force feedack ? Use DOF ?  Pinscape has some ports for adding lights and/or feedback devices.

I already had a ledwiz with 32 ports. If hou don't use that much, the pinscape can be enough as well (but realize that flashers and rgb flasher take up a lot of ports)

Note : if you want to use device like knocker, solenoids, blowers etc, do not attach them directly to you vontroller, but use small relais. Als use diodes to not blow up you device or psu

Surround sound feedback is really a must have (my opinion). It is not too expensive, but gives a very good pinball experience ( if the table author didn't mess with the sounds)

What kind of full DMD do you want ? Lcd or real 128x32 leds ?

Good luck with your journey!

 

For force feedback, I want to replicate flipper actuation and bumper feedback.  I may add a LED panel at the back at some point, but not high priority.  For DMD I am happy with the LCD display.  I don't really want a real DMD.  I definitely want an analog plunger as well as true nudge/tilt.  Then I can free up my nudge buttons for magna save.  Dont care at all about a blower.

I'm really loving working on my cabinet.  I could pay someone to build me one with all of this all ready to go, but that would be far less rewarding.

 

[MrGrynch]

UPDATE:

My display upgrade is complete.  I had some issues crop up after the install, but got some great help from @Mike_da_Spike and others.

Because the original table had mounts custom-made for a particular display, I had to create a new mounting system.  I wanted it to be future proof, with the ability to tilt up and lift out, with VESA compliant mounting.  I also wanted the mount to be perfectly centered with the table, so I could use sliding bolts to adjust the display up/down.  This required a TON of measurement and careful cutting.  I think I did ok!

I tested the swivel up and lift-out feature and that worked great. (see attached video)

I was originally going to use a VESA wall mount on my frame.  I mounted it and tested the mounting arms.  They seemed too flimsy, and had too much play for something that wasn't going to relay on gravity to hold it onto the mount.

My new display arrived.  Its a Sony Bravia (KD-43X85J) 43" 4K display.  I had my eye on this display for several reasons.

• It's a direct-lit display
• It's 120hz native refresh
• Very fast response time
• Great viewing angle
• Great color accuracy
• Dimensions were perfect for my cabinet

What was not so perfect was the price.  New, these displays go for about $600.  I found a slightly used one for $300

Unfortunately, the TV did not come with the VESA spacers needed to mount it, so I contacted the seller and they sent me out a set right away.  They were the wrong size for my TV.  So, I found the Sony replacement parts website and ordered the correct  spacers.  This whole process took about a week, and the seller was very good about it.  He reimbursed me the cost of the spacers.

In the meantime, I did a dry-fit of the TV into my cabinet.  As I had hoped, the dimensions were perfect!  And the display looks amazing!

While I waited for the spacers, I decided to cut a solid board to mount the TV to instead of the wall mount I purchased.  I would drill the VESA screw holes and cut recessed slots to allow adjusting the TV up/down inside the cabinet.  I had to make sure the board was square

I purchased a Plunge Router tool for my Dremel rotary tool.  This would allow me to create the recessed slots.

This went well until the very end.  While cutting the slots that allow the board to move up/down with the bolts, the board split.  Apparently this isn't a very good wood for this kind of application.  So, I went with Plan B.  I would drill the VESA mounting holes into the board and attach fixed screws.  Then I would slot the frame itself to facilitate up/down adjustment.  To correctly position the VESA holes, I created a quick image in Gimp that was 200mm x 200mm, put a mark in the exact center, and then pinned it to the board to mark the four holes

I recessed the bolt holes to keep the heads flush

I attached the board to the TV..  The VESA screw holes were aligned perfectly, and the TV was easily attached.  The slots in the board were my first attempt which failed due to the cracking of the board.  I pushed the fixed screws the bottom of the board in preparation to fit to the mounting frame

I attached the mounting frame with the slots, and tested the movement (see video)

I secured the TV to the mounting frame, and tested the tilt up feature.  The measurements were perfect and the TV lifts up easily with just enough angle to keep it upright.

I reattached all of the edge pieces and locking bar and fired up the machine.  It looks amazing!

The whole project took a little over a week, thanks to delays getting the spacer, 10th wedding anniversary, and dealing with failures in the original design.  I am very happy with the result.  Now I need to figure out which project is next!

 

 

 

 

 

[Draco1962]

Very nice and a perfect DIY mount! A few questions:

First, other than the wood cracking while using the plunge router, did you find that the attachment for your Dremel was a sound purchase?

Second, are you leaving the palyfield and backglass monitors open or do you see installing safety glass in the future?

Mike

[MrGrynch]

2 minutes ago, Draco1962 said:

Very nice and a perfect DIY mount! A few questions:

First, other than the wood cracking while using the plunge router, did you find that the attachment for your Dremel was a sound purchase?

Second, are you leaving the palyfield and backglass monitors open or do you see installing safety glass in the future?

Mike

The Dremel Plunge Router is a game-changer for these small projects.  I don’t do much work with wood, so can’t justify the cost/space of tools.  This was $20 very well spent.  Now I just need a jigsaw attachment.  They have cutting bits I might check out.

The backglass and playfield already have tempered glass in front of them.  Only the DMD is unprotected

[tthurman]

Excellent work!

I love these build threads, so cool to see what everyone is doing and the different methods they use to achieve the same end goal.

Thanks!

[MrGrynch]

Next project…

Opening up the 4:1 DMD aperture to be a FullDMD (16:9) display.

 

[MrGrynch]

Since I need to do this in place, I need to make sure I have the correct measurements, the cut lines are true, and I don't tear up the laminate around the edges.  The laminate is black, which is difficult to visibly mark cut lines.  I used masking tape which serves two purposes.  First, its white, so I can mark it clearly for cutting.  Second, I am hoping the tape will keep the cut edges from fraying the laminate too badly around the cuts.  We'll see if it works.  I ordered a Dremel multi-purpose cutting bit to act something like a jig saw.  I will make the cuts slightly inside the marked lines to compensate for an unsteady hand, and fraying of the laminate.  I can sand down the cut to the exact measurements with finer control

 

[tthurman]

This is probably something along the lines of melamine.  Tape will help, but you may be able to limit it even more with some different techniques.

A high tooth count blade is an absolute must, the higher the better and a blade for fine wood cutting.  This may limit it, but things will still be going against you.

The reciprocating action of these type cutting tools combined with the "flex" the blade itself has makes this very difficult to do without some tear out.  There is also no kerf on these saws to assist the blade staying perpendicular to the work surface, which makes them more prone to flexing.

 

If I could make a suggestion it would be to test an area you're going to cut out anyway with the below ideas.

Use a utility knife with a new blade and score the laminate where you intend to cut it.  

Extend or redo your current tape to include longer and finer drawn lines so that you can see it with a sacrificial board placed over it.   

Position this bruise board  (any flat 1/4, 3/8.... pine/plywood etc. scrap wood you have and clamp the two together on at least the top surface or bottom if your cutting upside down) and use the extended lines you drew to strike out a line on the bruise board as a cutting guide.

 

The bruise board will keep pressure a on top of the laminate surface, which will minimize flaking and tearing on the upstrokes of the blade, since it is being forced to stay down and has nowhere to move as a result of the blade action.  

 

Every other blade tooth is angled toward the laminate on the blade during the upstroke, which will create a "picking" effect in rapid succession, the above will limit that since the laminate itself is trapped between the two pieces of wood.

 

These give some idea of what I'm trying to describe above.

 

 

 

 

 

[MrGrynch]

@tthurmanThanks for these tips!  For my cut, I chose to use the Dremel General-Purpose Cutting bit.  It 's used for cutting wood, and other materials.  I've never used it before, but it worked quite well.  It was slow going and took a little bit to use it effectively with control.  The rough cut is done.  Next up is to smooth the edges.  Then I will try to recreate the chamfer in the original before spray painting it black

 

 

[MrGrynch]

Cleaned up the edges and did a test fit. Seems perfect.  I still need to do some finishing work on the opening (reduces waves, spray paint). The Dremel did a great job.  With the masking tape, virtually no chip-out!

[MrGrynch]

Now that the opening is cut, there are tweaks to make to make sure its completely square, as well as adding the chamfer to match the original slot as much as possible (and minimize shadows on the display).  Since I am doing this in-place, I have to be creative.  To guide the chamfer, I put down masking tape and marked the start of the chamfer.  I will do the same on the inside edge, so I get as consistent an angle as possible by hand.

 

[MrGrynch]

And now.. I have a FullDMD!

[Draco1962]

Very nice! No jaggy lines and well trimmed!

[tthurman]

Oh  I missed that you intended to do this while in place.  

You certainly have steadier hands than I do.
Nice work!