Batman '66 and PBX

[DJO Maverick]

1. Give a brief description of you sytem setup (2/3 screen setup, feedback, addressable leds)
   3 screen cabinet with FullDMD and standard suite of DOF devices
2. Are you using any 3rd party add-ons (dmdext, doflinx, PUplayer)
   Freezy external DMD extensions, PUPlayer for tables that require it (like this one)
3. Define which emulator you are having issues with (VPX, Future Pinball, FX3)
   VPX 10.8 RC4
4. Is the issue table specific or an issue for all tables? If so please state the table name.
   Unique to Batman '66
5. Does this issue occur only when launching the game via PBX?
   Only via PBX, no issues when launching directly from VPX or competing frontend
6. What Version of PBX are you on?
   Current (6.07)
7. Attach your Pinball X xml, ini, and log files, DO NOT COPY THE CONTENTS INTO YOUR QUESTION, attach the actual files.
   Attached.

When launching Batman '66, it is supposed to trigger the credits.mp4 video for attract mode, with the theme song and such.  When launching it via PBX, it acts like it is trying to start that video for a split second, then it disappears and goes back to the rest of the otherwise expected DMD activity.  There do not appear to be any other issues with the pup videos and PBX; it appears to otherwise work normally, except for that initial video.  This does not occur when launching from VPX directly, or Popper.  This was not always an issue (as evidenced by me having successfully recorded a DMD video of it for PBX in the past), but I cannot seem to find a rollback that eliminates the issue.

log.txt PinballX.ini

[scutters]

Might not be the issue but your log shows the table launch as;

13:44:56.45  7/7/2024:  C:\Visual Pinball\C:\Visual Pinball\VPinballX_GL64.exe /play -"C:\Visual Pinball\Tables\Batman 66 (Stern 2016).vpx"

Which has 'C:\Visual Pinball\' twice. This is because you have included the path to Visual Pinball in the executable entry. Can you change that to include the executable name only and try again (go to settings.exe, Visual Pinball system and set the executable entry to just 'VPinballX_GL64.exe')

If the issue is still present please open a cmd prompt and paste this line in (which is the same as PinballX launching the table), does the issue exist then?

"C:\Visual Pinball\VPinballX_GL64.exe" /play -"C:\Visual Pinball\Tables\Batman 66 (Stern 2016).vpx"

 

[DJO Maverick]

Eliminated the path for the executable in PBX settings; no change.

And in a very interesting turn of events...  running from the command line as requested gives the exact same problem as launching from PBX.  I closed that instance, then relaunched VPX and selected the table from the menu to launch it...  and it worked fine.

[Mike_da_Spike]

2 hours ago, DJO Maverick said:

Eliminated the path for the executable in PBX settings; no change.

And in a very interesting turn of events...  running from the command line as requested gives the exact same problem as launching from PBX.  I closed that instance, then relaunched VPX and selected the table from the menu to launch it...  and it worked fine.

I've read more about the issues with Batman66 and VPX10.8.
Is it necessary to use the GL version rather than the standard DX version?
Does the DX version produce the same results?
You said  this issue doesn't occur with Popper. What are the command line parameters from Popper to launch this file?
Perhaps opening a GitHub issue or inquiring on VPF or VPU forums would be the best approach, as the command line seems to yield the same issue.

 

[scutters]

5 hours ago, Mike_da_Spike said:

What are the command line parameters from Popper to launch this file?

Agree. There must be difference in the launch parameters, possibly using a different VPX executable (the DX, or a 10.7 version)?

[DJO Maverick]

Update from retesting now...

So for starters, PBX still demonstrating the same issue.  I went back and started testing different exes at command line...  With same command as yesterday, 32 bit GL worked...  all 3 other flavors of 10.8 exe worked...  and then retried 64 bit GL, and today IT worked, repeatably, from command line.  Went back and retested same exe from PBX, and the glitch remained, every time.

After that, went and tried command line 64 GL again to see if PBX was doing something that lingered and caused an issue...  however, launched repeatedly from command line without issue today.

No clue why command line launch caused issue last night but not today.  At this point, command line launch is fine, PBX launch continues to have the same issue every time.

As for what is different with Popper...  I barely have it installed just to test it and haven't altered any of the default launch parameters, it's also set to use GL 64 version.  So, whatever its default arguments are.

[DJO Maverick]

PS - Now have also tried running through PBX with alternate exes...  tried all editions of 10.8 with PBX, same result.  Can reacquire a 7.4 later to try with it as necessary.

[Mike_da_Spike]

Hey, can you post a video of what's happening?

I know Pinup Player tries to keep VPX in front, so if any video goes to the back, it could be caused by that too.

But if you show a video, we'll have a better idea of what's going on.

[scutters]

If the cmd prompt is now ok using the same launch parameters as Pinballx (and pretty much the same as popper from what i can tell from this post https://vpuniverse.com/forums/topic/9212-pinup-popper-will-no-longer-open-vpx-since-check-for-valid-command-line-parameters-1942-was-released-solved/?do=findComment&comment=74876) then it may also be worth checking you haven't at some time enabled some windows compatibility mode for the PinballX executable as they can have some strange side effects.

[DJO Maverick]

Confirmed no compatibility options are on.  Will figure out how to capture DMD only; maybe can abuse Database Manager to accomplish it, if recording will start fast enough.

One new experiment of note: went ahead and reacquired 7.4.  When set to launch 7.4 64bit, PBX loading screen would give way to the error message complaining that the table was saved in 10.8.  After clicking to launch anyway, PUP intro DID work normally, three times in a row.  Obviously not desirable to roll back just for PBX purposes when it otherwise works fine in 10.8, but, there you go.  It at least made me wonder if launching from PBX is in some way affecting the speed or order of add-ons like the pup player loading...  and maybe the mere fact of VPX pausing for the nag confirmation was what made the difference?

[Mike_da_Spike]

  

3 hours ago, DJO Maverick said:

Confirmed no compatibility options are on.  Will figure out how to capture DMD only; maybe can abuse Database Manager to accomplish it, if recording will start fast enough.

IDK. I use a real DMD and won't capture anything with DBM
I capture sometimes manually the output to make a nice logo of it and create the follow video to be displayed on my DMD : 

 
 

3 hours ago, DJO Maverick said:

One new experiment of note: went ahead and reacquired 7.4.  When set to launch 7.4 64bit, PBX loading screen would give way to the error message complaining that the table was saved in 10.8.  After clicking to launch anyway, PUP intro DID work normally, three times in a row.  Obviously not desirable to roll back just for PBX purposes when it otherwise works fine in 10.8, but, there you go

it's just working as it should. The table file was saved in a newer version of VPX and could have some problems.
Workaround : Open the table with a lower version (10.7.4 in your case), ignore the message and save the table. You won't get the popup again

[scutters]

It might be worth changing the visual pinball launch parameters in PinballX to;

-DisableTrueFullScreen -minimized -play "[TABLEPATH]\[TABLEFILE]"

.. so that it matches the default popper parameters. As you don't get the issue with the current launch parameters from a command line it shouldn't really change anything as the command line is doing exactly the same as PinballX is now (so i don't know what the issue/difference is). Alternative may just have be to save the table with 10.7 and then use the alternate exe flag in PinballX to launch with 10.7 for this table.

[DJO Maverick]

11 hours ago, Mike_da_Spike said:

Workaround : Open the table with a lower version (10.7.4 in your case), ignore the message and save the table. You won't get the popup again

I think I was inarticulately wondering out loud if there was some sort of race condition that the existence of the pop up delay was defeating.  But, the workaround does work; saving it in the old version and then forcing PBX to launch it with 7.4 still works, repeatably.  It's just not desirable to have to leave the benefits of 10.8 on the table and roll back just for the frontend, when 10.8 otherwise works fine...

6 hours ago, scutters said:

It might be worth changing the visual pinball launch parameters in PinballX to;

-DisableTrueFullScreen -minimized -play "[TABLEPATH]\[TABLEFILE]"

.. so that it matches the default popper parameters. 

Gave this a shot; no change in behavior.  Opening video still refuses to play.

Clearly this is some very edge case.  Possible never reported before by people who have only ever launched it with PBX, because they wouldn't realize the one misbehavior.  Just brainstorming, but is it possible that PBX's video player is not shutting down fast enough and 10.8 is causes B2S and the Pup plugin to load just incrementally faster, enough to conflict?  Granted I don't use a lot of PUP tables, only ones that need it (Futurama, Blood Machines, Die Hard, Munsters, Harry Potter, think that's it)...  but interesting that it seems to only affect this one.  I don't understand PUP scripting well enough to recognize if there's some material difference in how the Batman credits video is called.

[Mike_da_Spike]

42 minutes ago, DJO Maverick said:

Just brainstorming, but is it possible that PBX's video player is not shutting down fast enough and 10.8 is causes B2S and the Pup plugin to load just incrementally faster, enough to conflict? 

I don't know the code of pinballx, so not 100% sure. But you don't use b2sserver in frontend. And if you use Pupplayer, the b2s file isnt needed as all should be in the pupplayer.

Pupplayer is completely based on vlc for playing videos. Pinballx uses his own dx9 window. So I would say it doesnt have to do with it.

But who am I ?

Just thinking out loud : so the video is played, but behind the b2s file and only during attract mode? Is that what I hear ? If you rename the b2s file extension , so it wont load by b2sserver, will it show properly ?

 

 

[Draco1962]

Out of curiosity, are LAV codecs installed? Asking for a friend...

[DJO Maverick]

2 hours ago, Mike_da_Spike said:

I don't know the code of pinballx, so not 100% sure. But you don't use b2sserver in frontend. And if you use Pupplayer, the b2s file isnt needed as all should be in the pupplayer.

Pupplayer is completely based on vlc for playing videos. Pinballx uses his own dx9 window. So I would say it doesnt have to do with it.

But who am I ?

Just thinking out loud : so the video is played, but behind the b2s file and only during attract mode? Is that what I hear ? If you rename the b2s file extension , so it wont load by b2sserver, will it show properly ?

 

 

I sure don't know the code either, but I was under the impression that the B2S server is still serving as an interpreter for both DOF and Pup, even without an actual B2S backglass, and that's why both require the server to be installed and running?

No, that's not what is happening.  The issue is the attract mode video (credits.mp4, I believe) does NOT play at all.  It APPEARS that it might be trying to start at the right time for a split second (there's a bit of a momentary visual hitch on the DMD when it should start), but immediately stops and goes on to what would otherwise happen next (display of high scores).  I would say there is a little bit of inconsistency with it.  I'd say 1 time out of 20 tries, the audio DID play, but even then, the video was not visibly playing in any window that could be tabbed to.  The other 19 times out of 20, there's no audio or anything other than the momentary glitch.

There is no standalone B2S file in play; it's a 100% pup table and the backglass is coming from pup.  Thus, nothing to rename.  B2S is being called by the table script.

1 hour ago, Draco1962 said:

Out of curiosity, are LAV codecs installed? Asking for a friend...

Yep, LAV codecs installed and configured.  Unless there's been some substantial update to that in the past year or so that would need reinstalled.

[Mike_da_Spike]

8 hours ago, DJO Maverick said:

I sure don't know the code either, but I was under the impression that the B2S server is still serving as an interpreter for both DOF and Pup, even without an actual B2S backglass, and that's why both require the server to be installed and running?

No, that's not what is happening.  The issue is the attract mode video (credits.mp4, I believe) does NOT play at all.  It APPEARS that it might be trying to start at the right time for a split second (there's a bit of a momentary visual hitch on the DMD when it should start), but immediately stops and goes on to what would otherwise happen next (display of high scores).  I would say there is a little bit of inconsistency with it.  I'd say 1 time out of 20 tries, the audio DID play, but even then, the video was not visibly playing in any window that could be tabbed to.  The other 19 times out of 20, there's no audio or anything other than the momentary glitch.

There is no standalone B2S file in play; it's a 100% pup table and the backglass is coming from pup.  Thus, nothing to rename.  B2S is being called by the table script.

I don't use pups normally, so added pinup player to my system and added batman 66 to my system.
I launched it with VPX 10.8 through PinballX, and the Pup shows fine for me. it also loads credits.mp4 with sound and video
I made a video of it :

I use the following versions :

VPinballX-10.8.0-1975 64bit
VPinballX_GL-10.8.0-1975 64bit
PinUpDisplay_v150_beta_3
VPinMAME-sc-3.6.0-998 64bit
B2SServer-2.1.2

attached also my log and ini file for reference

 

 

PinballX.ini log.txt

[DJO Maverick]

So I'm on the same versions of pup/vpinmame/b2s as you, but the major difference between our setups is that my table is set up to run in the 3 screen fullDMD mode.  With that, the back glass remains just the back glass, and all the pup videos run on the third screen.  They also all have overlay frames based on what's showing (ex: the credits appear as though on an old TV).

I should be able to check at lunch if PBX launches it right for me in 2-screen mode like yours to try and isolate the issue.

[Mike_da_Spike]

Sorry, I have a real dmd, so not able to test your setup

[DJO Maverick]

10 hours ago, Mike_da_Spike said:

Sorry, I have a real dmd, so not able to test your setup

You have deepened the mystery, Good Sir.  So I changed the table mode to 2 Screen (like your experiment).  When set to 2 screen mode, PBX consistently launches it correctly.  Launched repeatedly with no issues.

Swapped back to 3-screen mode, and the issue remains.  

So to recap...  I guess the table only has an issue launching from PBX, but ONLY in 3-screen mode, and then only with 10.8.

[DJO Maverick]

Ok, video, as promised. 

Side note: it does continue to load right once in a great while.  If it does at all, it will be the first attempt on a boot, then not again.

 

Edit: Clarifying, it doesn't stay on the black mini HUD forever...  I stopped the video before it rolled into high score display.

[Mike_da_Spike]

Not sure if this is a real PinbalLX issue as I cannot reproduce it myself, but I put it on the buglist