[RESOLVED] I lose ROM (backglass/music) sounds when launching through PBX

[MulletLife]

If I run direct from VPX, all sounds exist. When launching through PBX, center channel sounds are muted, ALL other sounds are present. Its basically all ROM sounds disappear. Just turned it on for the day and this occurred. Not sure if its Windows related. Fresh/updated install of PBX did not fix the issue. 

My first thought was to see if there was an issue with certain sounds not being able to play if PBX is hogging the audio channel. Haven't really been able to diagnose that though. 

Any thoughts?
Thanks

[Mike_da_Spike]

@Tom Speirs, is pbx doing something with pinmame before a game starts ?

I have some tables where I see a virtual DMD, but only when launched via pbx. 

Not sure if it is the same as above describe

[Tom Speirs]

The latest version of PinMame caused the headaches. Should use the latest version of PinMAME if not already.

I've got quite a lot on right now, sorry, but ill make sure Ill test its all working soon.

I cant think of anything other than to make sure hide dmd and other dmd settings and the like.

Tom.

[MulletLife]

20 minutes ago, Tom Speirs said:

The latest version of PinMame caused the headaches. Should use the latest version of PinMAME if not already.

I've got quite a lot on right now, sorry, but ill make sure Ill test its all working soon.

I cant think of anything other than to make sure hide dmd and other dmd settings and the like.

Tom.

I can check to see if I have the newest pinmame. I definitely keep the TOPPER (from PBX) running as I overlay the Freezy DMD onto the MP4 on a full Stern Style  TOPPER Screen. 

Thanks for the input, I'll see if that helps and report back for everyone

 

[MulletLife]

***UPDATE with moderate success****

I've done some additional testing if it helps with problem solving:

This MAY have occurred after a C++Redist update... maybe

- Downloaded news Sam build 3.5(beta??) and installed  via setup and setup64. 
No change
- Re-installed PBX 5.02 (from the newest)
No change

Have tested in VPX and get full sound under 2.1 settings and 7.1 settings.
Tested with PBX launch with 2.1 sound (in VPX, not windows) and 7.1,  no rom sounds. 

Tested with PBX with 2.1 sound (Windows),  ROM sounds now exist. 

So is this a Windows issue, or is PBX somehow not picking up 7.1 sounds from Windows???
The saga continues....

[scutters]

7.1 sound is ok for me with pinmame 3.4 via PinballX 5.41 on Win11.

@MulletLifedid you have issues before the update to pinmame 3.5? Might be worth attaching your pinballx.ini file anyway, maybe there's a setting in there that could affect it.

 

[MulletLife]

17 minutes ago, scutters said:

7.1 sound is ok for me with pinmame 3.4 via PinballX 5.41 on Win11.

@MulletLifedid you have issues before the update to pinmame 3.5? Might be worth attaching your pinballx.ini file anyway, maybe there's a setting in there that could affect it.

 

It was running fine for a few weeks. I turned it on today and this was the issue. Hence why it may have been a windows update, or maybe a c++ that I installed in the interim that broke something. I'll see about grabbing the ini and pasting here. That reminds me I should grab the ini from a known working setup I have and seeing if an overwrite solves the problem. 

I feel like from my diagnostics its PBX related, but may be a PBX bug caused by windows drivers....

[MulletLife]

Here's a copy of the INI

I've also swapped out the external 7.1 soundcard with a completely different branded soundcard,  no difference. 

So far my biggest clue is that Rom/music occurs when windows is set to 2.1, but not when set to 7.1.

My 2 main tables that I'm testing (as that's helpful) are Attack From Mars and Bad Cats. One has puppaks, one doesn't. That doesn't seem to make a difference. 


***FWIW - I did a fresh install on a new PC, same specs but WIndows10, PBX 5.02 Sam3.4, works perfectly fine. I'd love to not rip this PC out of a 100% finished cab if I could help it. 

PinballX copy.ini

[Draco1962]

What about PBX 5.41 on the other PC? Effort is better served troubleshooting the latest version.

[MulletLife]

Good news for those who are following along. 

I renamed my PinballX folder to Pinballx_.  Installed 5.02 to PinballX and copied over my config and databases from the older folder. Everything works!
I then copied over all the Folders (not the root dir files). It mentioned 172 files to overwrite. One of those 172 files must be the culprit as its now broken again. 

I feel the end is in sight. I will deleted, reinstall, and test folder by folder to see if I can find the issue. If I can find the singularity and it is a legit bug, I'm sure Tom will appreciate the info. 

If anyone feels like placing bets on the culprit.... Its somewhere in the folders but likely not the Config or Database folder.  My guess is Media or Plugins.



EDIT - Its the MEDIA folder.  Need to track down which specific sub folder is the issue, but it is 100% in the media folder. If anyone has an educated guess as to a file or folder that may be the culprit. 

[MulletLife]

1 hour ago, Draco1962 said:

What about PBX 5.41 on the other PC? Effort is better served troubleshooting the latest version.

I can install 5.41, and will likely update once the issue is resolved. I'm at the point that I'm 100% confident the PBX version is not the issue. I'm close and I'll have an answer tomorrow.

[Mike_da_Spike]

1 hour ago, MulletLife said:

Good news for those who are following along. 

I renamed my PinballX folder to Pinballx_.  Installed 5.02 to PinballX and copied over my config and databases from the older folder. Everything works!
I then copied over all the Folders (not the root dir files). It mentioned 172 files to overwrite. One of those 172 files must be the culprit as its now broken again. 

What version of 5.40/5.42 do you have of pbx ? I mean,  5.02 was the old .net and now ot is updated to .net corr 6. Check if you have the same issue with pinballx w7/vista edition. Or ypu using that ? 

[scutters]

8 hours ago, MulletLife said:

EDIT - Its the MEDIA folder.  Need to track down which specific sub folder is the issue, but it is 100% in the media folder. If anyone has an educated guess as to a file or folder that may be the culprit. 

I'd start with any new media files, toppers first as you keep them showing in game. Weird that media could affect pinmame when launched via PinballX, an unmuted video or something if not not set to hide on game launch?. Interested to know the cause!

[MulletLife]

So I've tracked it down but don't have a resolution as of yet. 

3 screen setup - backglass, topper (full screen), playfield. 

The PinballX Topper Media folder is the cause. Specifically, some of the files are fine, others will cause the issue. For EX, Bad Cats won't play sound. But its not an issue with that table, the issue is with the topper file. I remove the topper, sounds work. Put the topper back, no rom sounds. 

I've downloaded and installed VLC 2.2.8 thinking that may be the issue, its not. 

I'm thinking its a CODEC or audio driver that is present in WIN10 that isn't native to WIN11.  That's my current guess. 
I have a LAV filter codec pack I install which I have reinstalled with no effect. I think there use to be a pack vpin people would install called Sharkey's, I'll have a look there as well. 

Another option is to put all the videos through ffmpeg and convert/strip sound or something so ALL files are the same audio/video codec and see if that works.  That said, I'm sure there's a fix that doesn't involve that step. I'm thinking a win11 update (maybe realtek drivers) was the culprit. Now just need the cure. 

Thanks for all the help so far guys. 

[scutters]

Good work tracking it down!

I guess the topper(s) in question is muted but still has an audio stream.

If you go down the ffmpeg route the -an flag will remove the audio stream from a video, something like this would work and copy the rest of the encoding to a new video (after adjusting for paths etc);

ffmpeg -i "Bad Cats (Williams 1989).mp4" -c copy -an "Bad Cats (Williams 1989) no audio.mp4"

Might be worth it with one video just to confirm anyway.

 

Not sure about the drivers, but stick with LAV rather than installing shark as well - just make sure it's the latest LAV (https://forums.gameex.com/forums/files/file/2451-lav-video-codecs/).

I probably wouldn't see the issue on my setup as the only videos in use are recorded via PinballX or PBX Recorder and they both remove the audio stream (afaik). 

 

[MulletLife]

53 minutes ago, scutters said:

Good work tracking it down!

I guess the topper(s) in question is muted but still has an audio stream.

If you go down the ffmpeg route the -an flag will remove the audio stream from a video, something like this would work and copy the rest of the encoding to a new video (after adjusting for paths etc);

ffmpeg -i "Bad Cats (Williams 1989).mp4" -c copy -an "Bad Cats (Williams 1989) no audio.mp4"

Might be worth it with one video just to confirm anyway.

 

Not sure about the drivers, but stick with LAV rather than installing shark as well - just make sure it's the latest LAV (https://forums.gameex.com/forums/files/file/2451-lav-video-codecs/).

I probably wouldn't see the issue on my setup as the only videos in use are recorded via PinballX or PBX Recorder and they both remove the audio stream (afaik). 

 

Thanks very much for the reply, I wish I would have seen it before tinkering.  Shark codecs KILLED my system. I ended up swapping hard drives so the issue is temporarily resolved. 
I'm now going to have to figure out how to undo what Shark did (its portable, didn't install anything, but the issues remain on deleting). Mainly, videos in PBX take noticably longer to load, and some backglasses even get stuck. What a mess. 


For Tom:  Perhaps there is an update that happened in WIN11 that conflicts with some audio codec. I know 100% that it worked fine, likely did an win update of some sort, then certain topper videos cause the center channel rom sounds to stop working on anything other than 2.1 (in windows audio setup).

PBX bug??? Maybe?? I think the root cause is elsewhere, but causes a conflict in PBX. This may pop as more people get on WIN11. Who knows. Hopefully there's enough info here to determine if there is something in PBX that is glitching and how to resolve it. 

Thanks everyone for their help. We'll call this resolved (for now). I'm sure FFMPEG conversions will likely do the trick be it an audio or maybe an alternate video codec used on some toppers. 

[MulletLife]

Bad and then good news (Only updating if this helps with bugs). 

Everything was fine with my WIN10 build.  I tried to install FX3 and it needed to update my 2010 and 2015 redistributables (x86 and x64).  This is what I think broke things as the ROM sounds once again stopped working. This is the bad news. 

Good news. I ran the Topper MP4s through TerryReds FFMPEG script (30fps no audio) and we're back and action. I'm going through and converting all my toppers now to mitigate this issue. To my knowledge, the toppers never had sound to begin with but maybe it was a muted/low audio channel?? I have back ups of the MP4s if anyone wants/needs to test it to fix the bug. 

Thanks for the help everyone.