Finally going to try WHS 2011

[hansolo77]

I realize that my current setup of WHS v1 is working just fine. However, I'm running into some issues because of the 32bit x86 architecture. WHS 2011 is x64 and should work much better. I'm also wanting to do a massive spring cleaning on my drives. I've been working on a major round of disk management this week where I've been trying to equalize my drives and then a deep level defrag. One of my big issues I'm facing now is that I'm running out of disk space (again) and I don't have any more SATA ports available to me. Also, my motherboard apparently won't support +2tb hard drives. I've been in communication with the manufacturer (Asus) and the first response I got said it would work, then they gave me a link to verify and I couldn't, then they replied saying it can't. So, whatever. If my motherboard won't support a +2tb drive, I'm pretty sure (based on comments/reviews) that the one SATA controller card I bought can. I bought a 4tb hard drive the other day from Amazon (it's not here yet). I have like 4.25tb of data stored in my /video shared folder (TV shows and Movies). I'm going to get rid of some things to make it all fit on the 4tb drive. The other stuff I have I'm planning on dumping onto another drive. Then I'm going to redo the whole server. I don't have any more money at the moment, but I'd like to get a new case (this one is till from the fire days) and maybe a new motherboard that supports more drives and maybe USB3. But that's a long way off.

I've created a list of things I plan on doing in a certain order, in hopes that my upgrade to WHS 2011 will go smoothly. Has anybody else done an upgrade? I know some of you have WHS 2011, but I don't know if anybody did an upgrade. Does this list look like I've covered everything?

01 - Dump /videos to 4tb drive.02 - Dump /shares to other drives03 - Erase all shares04 - Remove drives 1 at a time05 - Format Boot Drive06 - Install WHS 201107 - Install StableBit DrivePool (https://stablebit.com/DrivePool/)08 - Install StableBit Scanner (https://stablebit.com/Scanner)09 - Add drives to Pool10 - Dump /videos to Pool11 - Dump /shares to PoolExtra Software to Install01 - Lights-Out02 - HD Sentinel (might not be needed with StableBit Scanner)03 - SpeedFan04 - PerfectDisk05 - CuteFTP06 - HDDRegenerator07 - Emby?

I put Emby with a question mark because I'm not sure if I can do that or not. Emby is the new name of Media Browser ("M B" lol). They've changed from a completely localized setup, to having a server and client setup. The server runs in the background, and the client connects to the server for all the database entries, etc. I had planned on installing this to the WHS, but because of the x86 limitation of v1, I couldn't (Emby requires x64). With the upgrade to WHS 2011, I should be able to install it on the server, and then just have the minimal client on my HTPC. It's a future plan to work out.

So what do you guys think?

[stigzler]

I upgraded my EX495 to WHS2011 a year or so ago. Will help if I can. Lots of text there, Hans... what's the question?

[hansolo77]

Lol, just wondering if I missed anything for my upgrade.

[Adultery]

/Off-topic: What exactly is the advantage to using something like WHS 2011 over Nas4Free or FreeBSD? I don't understand why you would go through all this trouble over a discontinued software, especially considering all the advantages the alternatives have (aside from being free).

[stigzler]

For me, im not too confident with netwotking stuff. So having a winodows server os just felt like it mihht make setups a little easier. Plus, my media playef boxes , wdtvlive are setup with windows network shares. Tbh, I quite like whs2011 when used with stablebit. Its better than v1 and very stable

[stigzler]

Oh... and dont forget AVirus software. Nod32 has an specific version for whs2013. Not vrry often I fork out for av software,but feels vital on your server.

[hansolo77]

My primary reason for wanting to use this over something like FreeNAS is because those other OS's operate on a programming system I'm completely unfamiliar with. I wouldn't know how to get programs for it to customize how it works. As much as I despise Microsoft's Monopoly and business practices, the truth is I'm comfortable using their software. Drivers alone would be such a chore that I feel it's just easier all around to stick with what I know.

[stigzler]

Just spent a day on my server, Hans and would second your intentions. I do love OpenSource, but sometimes there's just too much to do and not enough hours in the day...

[hansolo77]

So this is going to probably be a summer long project, building in steps on a weekly/by paycheck method. I've been spending a lot of time over at Amazon.com and looking at stuff I'd like to get. Ultimately I'd love to get one of those actual 4U server racks and storage cases that hold like 20 drives. But realistically I'm gonna have to just use what I have available. If somebody around there in the internets would happen to have a standard ATX full tower case they're not using, I'd love you forever!

As it stands right now though, I'm using this hardware configuration (not updated since the fire)

Case: Cooler Master CM690 Mid Tower (image/image)

Power: Antec HCG-750 (link)

Mobo: Asus P5G43T-M Pro (link)

Processor: Intel Celeron 420 @ 1.60 GHz (link)

RAM: 3.96 GB (Unsure of Make/Model)

Video: Onboard

Expanded Drive Cage: iStarUSA SAS/SATA 6.0 Gb/s Hot-Swap HDD Cage, Black BPU-350SATA (link) (I don't think mine is 6Gb/s...)

Hard Drive Controllers (in order of purchase): VIA VT6421 (link), Silicon Image SIL3112 (link), IO Crest 4 Port SATA III (link)

Hard Drives: 3x2TB, 2x1.5TB, 5x1TB, 4x500gb (various manufacturers and models)

A trip down memory lane... Originally, I bought the case because it had 5 hidden 3.5in drive bays that were cooled directly by a fan, and then 5 non-hidden 5.25in bays for future expansions. I bought the motherboard because at the time it was the only one at my store that had the most SATA ports with a GB network connection. I wasn't aware they made expansion controller cards. The processor was just meant to be the cheapest, lowest speed possible that the mobo could support since all WHS documentations pointed to a very low requirement. The RAM was originally 1 stick of 1gb, but I found I needed more for streaming video and had since upgraded to 2 sticks of 2gb. I also had a very old, used power supply from my old gaming rig (Windows XP old). It supported 400 watts of power, which was plenty for my underpowered setup and 2x100gb drives. As time progressed, I found it easy to add new drives to the pool, and with dropping costs I was able to triple the storage capacity in no time. Eventually, I had 6 drives in total, and needed a way to store the 6th other than just laying on the bottom of the 5.25in bay. I opted to get that 5-bay cage. By turning it vertical, I was able to install it into 3x5.25in bays (5 drives out of 3 spaces is good!). The problem then became "how do I control these other 4 bays in the cage when my mobo can only support a max of 6 drives?" The solution was simple after a bit of research. PCIe controllers were extremely expensive, so I grabbed the first PCI one (VIA) through NewEgg. It had a bonus feature which allowed me to control my XBOX360's DVD drive, thus allowing me to mod it's firmware. After I did that, I went into my server. Unfortunately, I didn't like how it worked; there is an internal SATA port and and external one, which meant I have to have a cable routing through an empty expansion plate. The next card I was to get I decided would be completely internal, thus the Silicon Image one. So that gave me my 10 drives, 5 internal and 5 hotswap. I was living good. Then I started running out of drive space again (with folder duplication (Microsoft's software mirror RAID) taking half my space). I soon started upgrading to 1TB and 1.5TB drives. Around this time, we had the fire, and slowly all of drives started to fail (see my older posts here). Now they're completely new and chugging along great. Then I found 2x2TB drives in the dumpster where I live, and now I had no way to install them! I decided I'd future proof my next purchase and decided to get the 4-port IO Crest controller. The benefit to this card is not only is it capable of 4 drives, but it is also capable of 6gbps speeds. Something else I've discovered (while researching on Amazon) is that this controller card is capable of +2TB drives, where as my motherboard isn't, which will be a plus in the future. So now I have 14 drives in total, all being controlled and working happily together.

And now the future....

Phase 1 Purchase - I'm currently sitting on 14 drives, with about 13.65TB of storage space. If my past history is any indication of storage usage, I'm going to need to upgrade. Currently on order to arrive sometime this week is a 4TB NAS drive (link) which will be used in the short term to dump all of my videos to. Right now, I have no extra drives to spare, and installing WHS 2011 will erase all my drives, so I needed something large enough to hold all my videos (TV Shows and Movies). I've also got on the way an External Drive Case (link) that will hold the drive while I dump to it. Once I get everything dumped, I will erase those files from the server, thus freeing up the space to dump everything else (about 1.40GB) that is shared onto one of the 2TB drives. The rest of the stuff existing (client computer backups, Emby meta-data, databases, etc) will just have to be recreated on the fly when the new install takes place.

Phase 2 Purchase - My system runs stable on the hardware side of things. Phase 2 (next paycheck) will include things to beef up my server's internal hardwares. I'm going to upgrade the CPU first. I'm planning on getting an Intel Core2Duo (link) which is a significant (nearly x3) upgrade, and $18 can't be beat. It's even going to be better than my current HTPC. I thought about getting a Quad Core, but that's just going to be over kill I think, and I've actually read some reviews that say this chip is better than the quads anyway. I'm also going to be getting my very first SSD drive (link) to install the WHS 2011 OS on. I didn't want to go crazy with the storage on that, since it's only going to store the OS. My current setup is using only 20GB on the primary drive, but I didn't want to go so small that I might run into problems in the future. Once I get these purchases from Amazon, I'll start with the installations.

Phase 3 Purchase - This is a minor purchase but will be welcome in the new build. I'm going to add another 4gb RAM to the system by way of this: (link). I don't really know why I'm going with that one, other than that it has the max capacity my mobo will support, has useful heat spreaders, and is the cheapest Amazon offer. By the time I get around to buying this, there might be something else available.

Phase 4 Purchase - This is the area I will be wanting to get to in the distant future. Of course, I will probably be getting at lease 1 and maybe 2 more 4TB NAS drives because the space is awesome at the price, and the NAS features make it ideal for my setup. But the big thing I'm going to be setting my sights on is a new controller card (link). This card is actually outdated compared to the new stuff that's out, but it'll give me something to work with until my future server build in a few years (if at all). There's new technology with this card that I will have to spend time learning about, such as the mini-SAS (1 plug expands to 4 SATA plugs). I realize it's designed for a RAID setup, but I really don't like the limitations RAID imposes on the user (you have to have the same make/model drives). Since WHS 2011 doesn't have a Drive Extender, I plan on using StableBit Drive pool as it seems to be the most user friendly and has the highest review ratings. That "software mirror RAID" will work just fine for me. The other purchases in this "maybe never" category include stuff like a new motherboard that will support USB3.0 and a larger case that won't require jury-rigging hot-swap drive cages.

Whew! Sorry for the long winded speech, but it WAS my thread! I'm going to use this as a sort of DIY journal and also for insights into discovery and knowledge as I go.

So, sound like a doable plan? LOL!!

[stigzler]

Im not sure about the middle bit...

[hansolo77]

What middle bit?

[tthurman]

Support would be my biggest concern. No extended support?

7

8

not surprising, but no info concerning 10

[stigzler]

Sorry Hans... Was messin given the phenomenally detailed post. Have read it now, though. I upgraded my ex495 to a duo core and this has proved more than sufficient for hd streaming and mtorrent activities. Also runs real cool. 4 gb ram also more than sufficient but 8 should fitureproof it nicely

Good Luck transferring all that data. Quite a task. What you gonna do with your old drives?

[hansolo77]

Support would be my biggest concern. No extended support?

7

8

not surprising, but no info concerning 10

I'm actually not worried about the support. Once you get your system stable, the only support updates are going to be security. And if you only use your system for file storage, there's really no reason to update it. WHS v1 support ended years ago, but I still have my system running fine with it, and it still gets updates every now and then. Once I install, I'll get the updates, then been happy. I know there's newer server OS's available from Microsoft, but they would require a more dedicated amount of time to actually configure and setup things, whereas WHS makes it all so simple and ready to go after install. I really know nothing about the inner working of being a server admin, like establishing the shares, group policies, etc. WHS does it all automatically.

Sorry Hans... Was messin given the phenomenally detailed post. Have read it now, though. I upgraded my ex495 to a duo core and this has proved more than sufficient for hd streaming and mtorrent activities. Also runs real cool. 4 gb ram also more than sufficient but 8 should fitureproof it nicely

Good Luck transferring all that data. Quite a task. What you gonna do with your old drives?

Yeah I went a little overboard, but I thought I'd finally nip it in the bud as to my history with my WHS. It's nice to know that my planned upgrade will be helpful. Now that I have a seedbox, I don't really need to worry about torrenting on my server, which is a huge plus. My upload speed is horrible so I would typically have to have my WHS on 24/7 for months to get to that treasured 1:1 ratio. Now I have no trouble letting the seedbox server take all the time and energy. The 4gb RAM I have does have it's limitations when I do a lot of multitasking and transcoding to the living room. Hopefully the increased CPU will also help with that. As for the drives, I'm not really going to get rid of them. I still have 2x5.25in drive bays free, and I was thinking about getting another drive cage (3x3.5in) to fit in there. The thing I'm worrying about now is how I'm going to use the SSD. It's a 2.5in drive, and would require a 3.5in adapter. Since this case is "tool-less" I'm wondering if I could get a 3.5in adapter and still be able to install it into one of the drive bays. Something to consider/think about going forward.

I just got confirmation today that my 4TB NAS drive is on it's way along with the external drive enclosure. Last night I checked my server storage and I had 2TB free, so I "removed" one of the new 2TB drives from the storage pool and spent the day today copying over all of the shares that weren't in the /videos path. Once that's done (gonna take another 2 hours) I'll verify all the data was copied then physically remove the drive. Then I'll wait for the 4TB arrive, then do the same with the remaining /videos folder.

[stigzler]

Just think about when it's all up and running!

btw - what's a "seedbox"? (in short, layman's language)

[Draco1962]

Most SSD drives will ship with an adapter plate. My Samsung SSD came with one.

[hansolo77]

Yeah I checked Draco, this one doesn't. I'm going to have to buy one later on.

stig - A seedbox is a "server" located off site which you can use for your torrenting needs. Essentially, it does your uploading and downloading for you, at a substantially improved speed. The current plan I'm on at FeralHosting is only £10/month (roughly $15) and offers me 500gb of storage space, and speeds around 10 Gbits/s. I might upgrade it soon though to the next plan of 750gb because I'm constantly running out of space, and it's only $5 more. My ISP's speed where I'm located can barely do 8k/s (upload) on a good day, with maybe 10k on a great day. Plus, you get the benefit of being more secure with your sharing because you're using secured connections, secure FTP, VPN, etc. It's a great deal all around.

[tthurman]

It's based on 2008 R2, so it probably follows that support cycle.

Given that it is you should receive security updates a little more than four more years.

"Extended support ends on 14 January 2020."

[hansolo77]

Just a quick update. Phase 1 (4tb HDD) has been purchased and delivered. Phase 2 (CPU and SSD) has been ordered and shipped (not yet delivered). I did, however, receive the SSD yesterday. I've been working on backing up shares to spare drives and removing drives from the pool. I figured for the new build I will have the largest drives appear first to the BIOS, so they'll be taking longer to fill up with data, as opposed to smaller drives filling up quicker. As it is right now, I have all shares backed up except for the 3.75tb of /videos. I started the backing up of /videos last night to the 4tb drive. I'm a little bummed though because after adding it to Windows (using GPT format), the available drive space in total was only 3.63tb. That's typical behavior though, not having a full drive available. But the part that's bummed me is the fact that I had to delete some movies I hadn't watched yet to be able to make room. My TV Shows folder is the largest folder on the system, and it'll fit on the new drive so I'm doing that one first. When it's done, I'm going to have to try and copy the Movies folder one by one until I'm out of room, then copy those missing movies to another drive somewhere.

I wanted to ask the community of tech nerds here a question about the SSD though. I've never had one, and a thought popped into my head about it's longevity. I was reading a few reviews and watching videos, and it sounds like they're not necessarily guaranteed to last a long time. The memory chips have a finite number of reads and writes available to them. If that's the case, what is the typical amount available? This is especially important to me because the way WHS v1 operates, it creates 2 partitions on the OS drive. One for C:\ (windows) and one for D:\ (data). Whenever you copy/move something into the storage pool, it first writes it to the D:\ partition, then the drive balancer goes to work and moves the data to other drives. Because of this design, the first drive is actually being read/wrote to quite a bit. Is this going to be a problem if the OS is installed on an SSD? What kind of limitations should I expect? Also, (maybe to Stigzler), does the WHS v2011 even operate in this fashion? Since it doesn't have any drive balancing, and requires a 3rd party solution, does it even matter? I suppose I'll read up about the Stablebit Drive Pool I'm intending to use and maybe ask them. Ideally what I'd like to do is install the OS to the SSD, then begin the storage bits on the other drives, leaving the SSD free from the read/write issue.

[Draco1962]

I would definitely recommend if at all possible, eliminating the use of the data partition on the SSD if that is how WHS functions.

[stigzler]

Ah yeah - OK. On my system drive, there is also a second partition. But my setup uses StableBit drivepool - basically, I use the partition as a 'quarentined' zone from my drive pool. The pool sits on the three other drives.

Errr... so - you could just leave the partition on your system disk blank, or use it for things like server software downloads etc. Basically nothing that has regular read/write. Then StableBit will pool your other drives. In short - don't sweat it an dive in.

So, looks like:

C: and D: being on the same physical drive, and E, G and I being the pool drives.

[hansolo77]

Cool so you can actually tell StableBit which drives (and partitions) you want to include in the Pool. That's exactly what I wanted to hear! Thanks a lot Stigzler! Now here's a question for you. Does WHS 2011 then show you a "Shared Folders on Server" path like WHS v1 did? And if it does, how is that figured into StableBit? Do I just have to install StableBit before creating the Shares? Or does it take those pre-existing shares and then move them into the pool? And if a client machine is putting data onto the server that will go into the pool, does it go directly into the pool, or go into a pre-designated area (like whs v1) and then get moved out? Basing purely on the screenshot you provided, it looks like it will still install like WHS v1 and make the 2 partitions and have all the shares located in the D:\ partition. So how do you get around that?

I'm sure these answers are so simple, I just need to DO IT and not worry about it. I just like to have all the information I can.

Update.. TV Shows are now moved out, working on moving over Movies as much as I can. The upgrade to the CPU won't be for a few more days still, but if I remember my history, you can upgrade the CPU with no major issues after installing (Windows just declares new hardware). If it doesn't work that way, I'll just hold off and then install the OS later.

[stigzler]

To be honest, Hans, I can't remember. Think 2011 works differently to V1 in terms of how it manages files - plenty of documentation around. You're right - just do it - I don't remember the process being too arduous or difficult.

Hardest bit was sourcing a copy of WHS2011 itself! How you getting on with that?

[hansolo77]

Already got it. I'm going to try my first install today.

[Draco1962]

Best of luck!