Strange problem wirh databases

[greatflash]

Having a strange ol' time of it with editing databases in Access.

Been adding info to the Saturn .MDB (Cotton 2, boomerang, Tilt!, etc). I enter them as usual and save the mdb back to the correct directory.

I then open GameEx and enter the Saturn page. Some of my new entrys show info (publisher, year etc), some show info but not the nice text descriptions, some show info; but for a game above or below, and some show nothing.

I then delete the GameEx (gameex/data/) EMU_43.dbcache (this relates to the Saturns emu postition) and re-start GameEx and go to Saturn - some are now listed correctly and some that were correct may now be missing info. After a lot of messing about (and saving the database in 2000, 2002, and 2007 access formats) the infomation may show correctly. Now (if you are following me), if I now add a few more rom files to the saturn rom directory and run GameEx again - they mess up AGAIN! Argggh!

Has anyone else had this problem, or am I doing something silly yet again??

P.s. In the saturn mdb file, things like "The lost world - Jurassic park" are listed like this, but GameEx rewords to the better "Lost world - Jurassic park, The" and in doing so cannot find the entry in the database. I have renamed the database entry to the same ("Lost world - Jurassic park, The") and that at least works

[Stu1983]

I noted a couple of things like this in my Movie Collectorz thread, there are definitely a few bugs in GameEx when it comes to reading the info from the MDBs.

I had also noted that it didn't like .'s in the game names, this may also include other special characters like ! but I never checked

Something I noticed about extra .'s is that when you select a game it still tells you the publisher and genre but then when you bring up the game info screen it doesn't display the description.

Stu

[greatflash]

I noted a couple of things like this in my Movie Collectorz thread, there are definitely a few bugs in GameEx when it comes to reading the info from the MDBs.

I had also noted that it didn't like .'s in the game names, this may also include other special characters like ! but I never checked

Something I noticed about extra .'s is that when you select a game it still tells you the publisher and genre but then when you bring up the game info screen it doesn't display the description.

Stu

There is a known error with ' and others as posted here

http://www.gameex.info/forums/index.php?s=...ost&p=37133

Headkaze did mention a way this could be fixed. I have no idea if Tom fixed this in the latest release. I have avoided words with 's 't and especially &.

As to missing info when it is clearly in the database but not displayed, i wish i knew what i did to make it work and why it forgets it later??? If it is working and you do not edit the mdb or add/delete any actual roms - it will keep working fine, but otherwise.... Aaaarg!

[Tempest]

P.s. In the saturn mdb file, things like "The lost world - Jurassic park" are listed like this, but GameEx rewords to the better "Lost world - Jurassic park, The" and in doing so cannot find the entry in the database. I have renamed the database entry to the same ("Lost world - Jurassic park, The") and that at least works

Would this have anything to do with the option to rename games that start with "The"?

Just throwin' it out there....

[greatflash]

Would this have anything to do with the option to rename games that start with "The"?

Just throwin' it out there....

Yes - it does. But I personally prefer my list and roms displayed in the same way that nearly all rom tools name them (xxxx, the). Unfortunatley the existing databases mostly omit this and name the other way (the xxxx).

But the existing problem remains somewhere hidden in the way gameex caches the emulators database into the /DATA directory - something messes up somewhere???

[Stu1983]

Yes - it does. But I personally prefer my list and roms displayed in the same way that nearly all rom tools name them (xxxx, the). Unfortunatley the existing databases mostly omit this and name the other way (the xxxx).

But the existing problem remains somewhere hidden in the way gameex caches the emulators database into the /DATA directory - something messes up somewhere???

I noticed that if I deleted the emulator cache, then turned off 'change sort order for games starting with the', then let GameEx rebuild the cache and finally turn 'change sort order for games starting with the' back on again

I now still have have all the info displayed for games starting with 'the'

It's not a proper solution but I feel it shows that this is definitely a bug that Tom should address

Stu

[greatflash]

I noticed that if I deleted the emulator cache, then turned off 'change sort order for games starting with the', then let GameEx rebuild the cache and finally turn 'change sort order for games starting with the' back on again

I now still have have all the info displayed for games starting with 'the'

It's not a proper solution but I feel it shows that this is definitely a bug that Tom should address

Stu

Yeah - I had a play with that earlier

I also opened the database cache file for emu 43 (my saturn setup) from /DATA in notepad to have a look. You can see that several areas just contain the name of the rom and miss the extra data that is present in the original MDB file. There are lots of sections that go like this "Radiant Silvergun-||-||-||-||-||-||-||-||-||-||-||-||-||-||-||-||-" (Example from memory) and then the name of the next rom?? The data is def present in the original database.

Taken the database to work to play with Office XP and Windows XP to see if office 2007 (At home) is putting something extra in the DB that confuses the code Tom uses to cull the data.

Does anyone else (Headkaze - I'm pointing at you ) know of another program better suited to editing to MDB files??

[headkaze]

greatflash: I've started a new database project where all the databases will be re-created. I'll be working closely with Tom on any issues that arise. Your welcome to join the project and help out. You can edit the databases from the software I'll be supplying soon.

[greatflash]

greatflash: I've started a new database project where all the databases will be re-created. I'll be working closely with Tom on any issues that arise. Your welcome to join the project and help out. You can edit the databases from the software I'll be supplying soon.

I would be glad to help out. I do seem to spend an inordinate amount of time adding to the default databases and manually correcting publisher/developer data. (sega limited, sega ltd. etc ). Mobygames is a great resource, but does not cover every title (I don't believe anywhere does), this is esp. noticable with the Saturn database.. Also been having TONS (not) of fun with BBC model A/B and ZX Spectrum. The joys of this addiction

So, feel free to PM

[starbuck]

I'm one of those of us that just has to have every system and every game for every system. Since GameEx reads the databases, can it work like a map file and list every game thats in the database weather you have it or not. Then by checking it with your rom directory, color change the one's you have or don't have. (perhaps red for don't have, green if we have it, and yellow if not in database) That way if one us has a game not in the database we could submit the name etc. to someone to add to the database. Also this would tell us what games we still need. Seems like with all the work being done with the databases, this would be a natural update by Tom.

Requested this once in the request forum but didn'y get much response.

[headkaze]

I'm one of those of us that just has to have every system and every game for every system. Since GameEx reads the databases, can it work like a map file and list every game thats in the database weather you have it or not. Then by checking it with your rom directory, color change the one's you have or don't have. (perhaps red for don't have, green if we have it, and yellow if not in database) That way if one us has a game not in the database we could submit the name etc. to someone to add to the database. Also this would tell us what games we still need. Seems like with all the work being done with the databases, this would be a natural update by Tom.

The databases at the moment are primarily based around the GoodTools set. So if you download GoodTools you can actually get it to tell you which games you have missing. As for the games missing in the database, you gave me the idea to add a special "Add Missing Games" button so it can add in games from the databases which are missing from the dat files.

[greatflash]

I'm one of those of us that just has to have every system and every game for every system. Since GameEx reads the databases, can it work like a map file and list every game thats in the database weather you have it or not. Then by checking it with your rom directory, color change the one's you have or don't have. (perhaps red for don't have, green if we have it, and yellow if not in database) That way if one us has a game not in the database we could submit the name etc. to someone to add to the database. Also this would tell us what games we still need. Seems like with all the work being done with the databases, this would be a natural update by Tom.

Requested this once in the request forum but didn'y get much response.

It is an idea. I do tend to look at good, tosec, and no-intro when naming missing entrys in the DB to try and get the best ond closest match. I prefer to use good, but this misses many systems. Also - the naming of Iso's is very much a personal thing. I have yet to find anything to name them for me. There are too many formats (ccd,cdi,nrg,bin,iso, etc) and many different sized rips (some with audio, without, compressed, etc) that any naming tool does not stand much chance. In this instance, i use a web search (moby and others - If moby fails me) to try and find the best name format, or follow the "xxxxxx, The" format. This format is used on my iso, rom files and I may also add (REGION), i.e. (U), (S), (J) etc. and may also add (PROTOTYPE) if this is very different from the release rom, or if never released.. These additions seem to be ignored by GameEx's database matching.

Phew!

[greatflash]

The databases at the moment are primarily based around the GoodTools set. So if you download GoodTools you can actually get it to tell you which games you have missing. As for the games missing in the database, you gave me the idea to add a special "Add Missing Games" button so it can add in games from the databases which are missing from the dat files.

I must admit that it would also be a great treat for all GameEx users to have a database for a system that is 99.99999999% complete. As you note, the only problem that sticks its ugly head out and says Boo! is that not all people use the same naming convention, and in some cases; it is almost impossible to adhere to (systems that are not covered by good tools - there are quite a few). If it possible to add repetitve repetitions of names in multiple formats. Ie. dupe an entry with a modified goodname. (a button perhaps). An example of this that I came across was "sonic 3d blast" that is the same as "sonic 3d - flickies island". The rest of the data would be exactly the same? This also apears in the great "xxxxx, the" and "the xxxxx" debate I personally prefer "xxxxx, the". And (here he goes again) the naming convention for Iso dumps is rather hit and miss.

double Phew!

[headkaze]

greatflash: I'm glad your interested in helping out with the database project as it looks like you could come up with some great ideas on how to improve things for the future. I'm hoping to put as many automated ways to create the databases as I can.

Right now I've added support for matching GoodTool/NoIntro and TOSEC dat's. Some match great and some match not so great, but hopefully with enough testing we can get some sort of system that works. What doesn't match will have to be filled in manually which is why I need volunteers. I'm talking with Tom about adding support for these 3 naming conventions as a selectable option for each emulator. Either that or we could create separate databases for each one. Personally I like the idea of having all 3 to chose from and have each name inside the one database.

As for ISO's I found the TOSEC ISO collection of dat's might be worth adding support for. Since my program supports CLRMame dat's we could quite easily create databases for these.

If we had someone that had entire collections for most systems and kept them up to date we could create our own GameEx dat files using CLRMamePro. These dat files could match the GameEx databases so people could use CLRMamePro with our dats and know that their collection will correctly match the databases.

[greatflash]

greatflash: I'm glad your interested in helping out with the database project as it looks like you could come up with some great ideas on how to improve things for the future. I'm hoping to put as many automated ways to create the databases as I can.

Right now I've added support for matching GoodTool/NoIntro and TOSEC dat's. Some match great and some match not so great, but hopefully with enough testing we can get some sort of system that works. What doesn't match will have to be filled in manually which is why I need volunteers. I'm talking with Tom about adding support for these 3 naming conventions as a selectable option for each emulator. Either that or we could create separate databases for each one. Personally I like the idea of having all 3 to chose from and have each name inside the one database.

As for ISO's I found the TOSEC ISO collection of dat's might be worth adding support for. Since my program supports CLRMame dat's we could quite easily create databases for these.

If we had someone that had entire collections for most systems and kept them up to date we could create our own GameEx dat files using CLRMamePro. These dat files could match the GameEx databases so people could use CLRMamePro with our dats and know that their collection will correctly match the databases.

Tosec ISO is a great way of working for a naming convention for Iso images. It is not so hot when it comes to actually matching iso's and naming them, you need to also edit the contents of a .cue file for example). It is easy though to extract the naming formats used and to use them as a basis for the DB's.

It would be great to work with 100% complete sets. The problem is "what is a complete set?". Compare rom counts on the 3 mentioned dat tools for one system. They vary quite a bit.

Picking a naming set is a good idea (if you can remember what rom set you have ). Could not a DB contain variations on a naming convention. I know this would increase file size, but am sure this would not be a problem. I mean, from within your editor:-

Main entry

"lost world, The" (OTHER DATA) [link code]

"the lost world" (OTHER DATA) [same link code]

"lost world - jurassic park, the" (OTHER DATA) [same link code].............

Using the link code to link the 2 other variations to the main entry. So that in your editior you could have a display for the "lost world, the" entry followed by the other data entered (publisher, year, format) and after that an editable list of alternative naming variants? These could be added as needed and your editor could take the existing data from the header entry and replicate into the other entries so when saved the MDB contains several entrys for the same rom.

Hope that makes sense. I could code it easier than explain it

What I am trying to explain is using a relational database from the editor point of view and outputing a list-based database for GameEx use (would still need to retain [link codes] though).

So... When opened, sort by link code, lock, then sort by name feild (non-linked). when saving... Sort by name only and ouput MDB file...

Triple Phew!

This should not increase file size that much as lots of names would not need repeating ('hook', radiant silvergun, etc). Extensions to filenames in brackets ('hook (U)') do not seem to cause any problems for me if the initial name matches 100% with the DB.

EDIT:

Just created a short DB for gameex adding repetions of varied name conventions and tested against an existing rom set. Gameex had no problem picking the info out. renamed 2 roms and tried again, no problems there.

EDIT:

just realised - at the moment, this has not got me any closer to sorting my original problem with the Saturn database. Perhaps I will just wait and see what you come up with

Oh - Will your editior be able to import data from other DB files?

[starbuck]

I agree each of the different naming systems has flaws and each have roms that the others don't have. Lets use the best of all of them and by having the button Headkaze talks about we can create a new system that GameEx uses can use and build on. Every different system I use for naming my roms leaves out roms that I have. Each of my systems have a folder called unknown roms that I cull and add to my rom directorys. This why I use map files to get the proper names of my unknown roms. Using the databases for this function would insure that we all are using the same names and would also show us what games we need to submit to be added to the databases.

[greatflash]

Thats it... GOD!

I have piddled about with this Saturn game MDB for ages now and got no-where.... Aaaargh!

If all the games show data, then they show data for another game (bottom line, manufacturer, type, year) or failing that, they just miss data on certain games completely and the ones that have data have the correct data.

I have tried everything apart from changing religion, licking the light in the fridge, and placing random newspaper clippings on cocktail sticks. Nothing works...

p.s. before anyone asks, yes I did try forming minced beef into characters from The simpsons (simpsons, the) and placing them along the top of my garden fence.. and "NO", not even that helped!

p.p.s. I have a strange foreboding of doom... There are Vultures in my garden

[greatflash]

V9.37 has not helped with the database problem, I was hopeful.. Oh Well <sniff>